the average travel time in 1990 was 22 minutes. it has dried up -- jumped up slightly by three minutes. it has hovered around the 25 minute mark ever since. even the long commutes of an hour or more, it has remained about 8% since 2000. host: mr. puentes, your thoughts on these numbers staying relatively stable, even as we see gasoline prices jump up and drop down and spike over the years. why don't you think these numbers are being affected by gas spikes? guest: we are going through some dramatically dynamic changes in the country. we are still a growing population. we are heavily urbanizing, moving into metropolitan areas. some different -- demographic changes are disrupting the moment in american life. the fact that these numbers have stayed relatively constant is interesting. how long they want to travel by car to get to work. we know that there will be slight increases in things like transit use, and mode like walking and biking. there are these interesting trends that are happening in metropolitan areas, moving back into cent